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smoke
Oct 28, 2010 21:54:24 GMT -5
Post by norm75re on Oct 28, 2010 21:54:24 GMT -5
Hi all. Justfound this site by accident,wish it was around when I still had my RE. I was the first RE owner in Sydney (Feb 75) and had many trouble free,happy miles on it. It attracted attention every where I went,even got pulled over by the Highway Patrol on my first weekend trip just to have a look. The bike was put to pasture at the end of 79 when I bought a GS1000, but I would get it out for the occasional ride,until it started blowing clouds of smoke. I found that after sitting for a while the combustion chamber would fill with oil,which I think came from the injection tank. Before starting I would remove the exhaust manifold and turn the engine over slowly,which would push a large amount of oil out. With the oil removed the bike would blow smoke for a couple of miles then clear. Has any one else seen this problem.
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smoke
Nov 12, 2010 21:31:14 GMT -5
Post by wayne on Nov 12, 2010 21:31:14 GMT -5
Hi Norm, I too live in Sydney and bought an RE5 in August 1980 and have owned it ever since. When I put it back on the road in 2000, it was, according to the RTA, the only registered one in the state at the time (and I took the opportunity to get the road authority head office in Canberra to reclassify the bike as 497 cc, not the 1,000 cc that they had since the 70's).
This smoke issue is completely normal and common on rotaries of all types. I am told by a rotary mechanic who has worked on both Mazdas and Suzukis (and owns both) that the issue is with the side seal O rings. They become hard with age and oil seeps past and accumulates in the lower chambers. When started--------you see the results. I have seen my bike an others virtually make the driveway disappear in a smoke haze on first start after a long lay up. Don't worry about it too much. Very common.
Also, it is not uncommon for the bike to burn a lot of oil in the first 1000 k or so after long storage. As the seals soften up and start working again, things settle down. Minimal oil usage when running and no smoke on startup.
My RE went into storage in 1981 and was started every 2 years or so for the next 19 years. I've had plenty of practice at the cranky long lay up start and have seen the smoke many times. As a regular runner, this problem doesn't exist.
Cheers, Wayne
PS Did you buy your RE from Hazel and Moore ? Was the salesman John Steain ? John and I ride often and he mentions a "Norm" in connection with the RE back then. Was your bike featured in some Two Wheels magazines ? John bought his own RE earlier this year.
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smoke
Dec 17, 2010 6:14:40 GMT -5
Post by shadow on Dec 17, 2010 6:14:40 GMT -5
Hi just finished restoring my RE5 and after starting it for the 1st time it is also bellowing out smoke, Like your one was Wayne it is so bad I could not see two feet behind the bike.
I have not taken mine for a ride yet so I am hoping that it gets better. Are the side seals just an o-ring and do they get hard and crack?
So do you think it will stop smoking after a few 100K ride or if its to bad do you have to replace the seals?
Never had much to do with Rotary's but had to have one in my collection.
Four RE5 owners in Sydney wow my wife thought I was the only mad RE5 owner" ;D
John Steain been helpful with some set up tips and when I get a chance I will ring John and see about us Sydney RE5 riders getting together for a ride. As long as my smoking problems are fixed.
John F
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smoke
Dec 17, 2010 7:48:09 GMT -5
Post by ziggystardust on Dec 17, 2010 7:48:09 GMT -5
For new owners and also for long term owners that may not have seen inside their engine and wondered about seals this is my spare engine with the R/H side removed. You can see all the seals marked, the round side seals (John F) can be seen and do have an 'O' ring. This engine is to be my display engine at bike shows next year. It has a clear plastic cover to stop the seals from popping out and getting lost, you may notice that the 'O' rings are not standard, they are oversize ones just for show. The eccentric shaft can be turned to spin the rotor within it's housing but the seals could score the plastic cover.
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smoke
Dec 18, 2010 5:10:49 GMT -5
Post by wayne on Dec 18, 2010 5:10:49 GMT -5
John, I am told by a trained Mazda mechanic that the side seal O rings harden with age and do allow oil to weep by. However, they do improve and it seems rare that they will crack. When ridden regularly, my RE doesn't really smoke at all on startup. Another peculiarity is that in the first 1000 klm after the bike was started from long term storage, it burned 1 litre of sump oil which then settled down. John S had the same issue.
I'm sure that you'll find your bike settles and both smoking on start up and oil useage will settle.
I've seen the pics of your bike- looks absolutely spectacular. Looking forward to seeing it in the flesh. I have questions for you as I'm currently doing a ground up on a Blue M (Ron Keed tells me that you happened to have dropped your tank off for spraying about the same time I gave him mine along with an original blue for referencing).
Hope to see you at Bathurst if not before.
Wayne
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smoke
Dec 18, 2010 5:11:49 GMT -5
Post by wayne on Dec 18, 2010 5:11:49 GMT -5
Lee I have a friend over here who wants to do the same thing with a display engine. I'll pass on your pic as inspiration. Very nice.
Wayne
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smoke
Dec 18, 2010 15:22:48 GMT -5
Post by shadow on Dec 18, 2010 15:22:48 GMT -5
Thanks for your feed back Wayne. Jess has told me the same thing so I best get this thing on the road and get some miles on it.
Thanks for your comments on how it looks, Should have it 100% finished this week. I will post you a photo of the finished bike.
Thanks again for everyones help.
John F
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smoke
Dec 18, 2010 22:08:03 GMT -5
Post by wayne on Dec 18, 2010 22:08:03 GMT -5
And just to clarify, the O rings that we're talking about are not the 2 large O rings on the outer chamber but the single O ring on each side of the rotor itself. Lee's diagram has a tag "Side Seals" which splits in two. One points to the metallic blade seal, the other points to an O ring side seal. This is the seal which we're talking about. I believe that Mazdas use 2 per side but can't confirm that.
Cheers, Wayne
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smoke
Dec 21, 2010 17:24:38 GMT -5
Post by nickwin100 on Dec 21, 2010 17:24:38 GMT -5
Lee, Your display engine looks good. Its nice to be able to see inside. I have a spare engine myself, it appears to be unuseable with a oore plug missing. I might take one side off to see first hand how it looks inside, to see it in the flesh. Thanks for posting the photo...very interesting. Nick
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smoke
Dec 23, 2010 16:18:37 GMT -5
Post by ziggystardust on Dec 23, 2010 16:18:37 GMT -5
Nick,
One or more of my core plugs are rusted through, the apex seals are stuck and some side seals as well but hopefuly Ill never need the engine so Ill just use it for display for now.
Lee
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smoke
Dec 23, 2010 17:04:45 GMT -5
Post by nickwin100 on Dec 23, 2010 17:04:45 GMT -5
It certainly looks good how you have mounted it and readied it for display Lee.
By the way, I'm at the point of deciding which frame to shot-blast and paint ready for my rebuild...so, if you change your mind on exchanging the side casing with the engine number on it for one of mine Lee...let me know...and I'll use the mad-max frame with my good engine and be able to assemble it using the casing with matching engine number!!
Hope your having a nice holiday in Gran Canaria.
Nick
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